Check that all the insulators are in good shape, and reassemble the contact breaker assembly. Coil may still function somewhat and not completely failed but ratio of turns lost because of insulation breakdown. Lucas workshop instructions - magnetos Library Robert Bosch Documentation American Bosch workshop instructions Patents Books and learnd papers Workshop instructions - Lucas magnetos N1, KN1, K1F, K2F, KVF MO1L, MN2L Redesigned contact breaker for ring cam models SR magnetos (general info.) If excessively worn, replace the heel (BTH), or the moving-point assembly (Lucas). i totally agree. Measure the resistance with the two probes of your multi-meter shorted together. There has been requests lately on the board for more tech stuff. If there is a main-body earth brush and it is accessible, remove it and check that the spring is good, that the brush is free to move in the holder and that the brush is not unduly worn in length or diameter. Turn the armature in its proper direction of rotation until the contact-breaker points are just starting to open on one of the cam lobes. 2. If your magneto does not have an EasyCap but it fitted with a condenser buried in the armature, then it is impossible to check the condition of the condenser, while the armature is assembled, without specialised equipment. This causes the electromagnetic field in the primary coil to collapse rapidly. 0000005468 00000 n LUCAS K1F MAGNETO RUNNING AT 1200 RPM AT THE ARMATURE. "Specializing in Triumph and other fine Vintage motorcycles". If the brush is missing or there is only a very short piece in the pick-up, the brush (or part of it) may have come out and dropped to the bottom of the magneto housing. This is really common on original units as the Lucas condensers were made from wax paper and foil. 1. The turns ratio between the primary and secondary coil is selected so that the voltage across the secondary reaches a very high value, enough to arc across the gap of the spark plug. If the reading is less than 3000 ohms, it would be unusual, but is indicative of a problem. 0000001569 00000 n If the timing is not correct on both lobes, the reason could be that: the contact-breaker assembly is wobbly on the end of the armature; the cam or its housing were incorrectly machined (rare); with ring-cam magnetos, the armature and cam are not coaxial due to the outer race of the bearing at the contact-breaker end not being seated properly by its insulator in the cam housing. how they work; and to collate as much other That then produces a gap of about 4 mm between the centre electrode and the screw-threaded bit of the plug body. It appears that magnetio does not have in impulse coupling which means the engine must turn over much faster to develop as hot a spark as if there was an impulse. If the magneto is fitted with, or about to be fitted with, a Brightspark EasyCap, you can perform some basic checks on the EasyCap. 82 23 Thanks. She was factory fitted with a Morris Vedette MKII engine which has a lucas rf4 magneto. Under construction, so far showing video Magneto coils are usually a long time dying. There are several common faults with magnetos The Capacitor Capacitors, which are short-term storage devices, often fail in older magnetos due to dielectric degradation (short circuit) or conductor breakage (open circuit). Lister D Magneto Lucas RS1 full rebuild but still no spark - YouTube capacitance to satisfactory ignition system If there are any, replace the pick-up. Now that the slip ring has dried off, replace the pick-up(s). I wonder if hand-cranking might get it going. Then check that the contact-breaker assembly is not wobbly on the end of the shaft. These were on older equipment which hadcomplete tune upsthat wentto the field and didn't work more than a hand full or two of times and then they would begin to start hard, no start or run for a short time and shut off then not restart. Franaise Deutsch The ratio of turns in the secondary winding to the number of turns in the primary winding, is called the turns ratio. It is almost a given that a Lucas armature will require replacement if in the original condition. Voltage across the primary coil results in a proportional voltage being induced across the secondary winding of the coil. Turn the armature in its proper direction of rotation until the contact-breaker points are just starting to open on the other cam lobe. A really nice one will jump 1/2"or better. Also, some pattern contact-breaker assemblies are too large at the fat end and need to be filed or ground to size. Oil on the inside of the pick-up is usually indicative of a failure of the magnetos oil seal, in which case the magneto will need a more complete overhaul. MAGNETO MAGIC - PressReader Grease. tour of some of our specialised workshop After you get your spark strong enough, then worry about cap and rotor. I can guarantee every British motorcycle powered by a magneto i either not delivering maximum spark and/or is on the verge of failing if the original Lucas capacitor has not been replaced. Check the condition of the HT lead(s) and plug-cap(s) and replace where necessary. Don't want this buried as I 'm hoping for some possible answers today. replacement for the condenser (capacitor) in Upgrade your membership to All Contact Us - DO NOT EMAIL CAR QUESTIONS. LUCAS Magneto check "How To" - Jockey Journal Forum Feel free to buy the forum staff a coffee or pint or just make a contribution of your choice. Brightspark Magnetos is now able to offer a remagnetising service, using our specially-developed remagnetising and measuring equipment to help you restore your magneto to tip-top condition. If I was working on it, first I would want a 5/16" air gap consistent spark minimum from the coil terminal to ground. only for magnetos, but also classic motorcycle In a modern installation, the magneto only has a single low tension winding which is connected to an external ignition coil which not only has a low tension winding, but also a secondary winding of many thousands of turns to deliver the high voltage required for the spark plug(s). First test is to take the plug caps off the HT leads and position the ends of the HT leads 1/4" away from the casting. After a full rebuild my motor started right up, rode for 5 minutes, stopped, no spark. Excellent "how-to". asked questions, some of which isn't to be With the contact-breaker assembly still removed from the magneto, and with a multimeter set to measure resistance, check that with the points closed there is a short circuit between them (as close to 0 as your multimeter goes). We shall resume operations as soon as we possibly can. To all you guys with Lucas magnetos with problems, get ready to see it fully functional for about $23 shipped, along with a little work in your garage. Carefully check for any cracks or pin-holes in the pick-up. We can adapt for most applications. Check that the felt pad in the end of the screw holding together the two blocks of the points assembly is present and good, and soak it in oil. Many should appreciate. If the magnet is full strength and the spark at the points looks right then I would still say you have a coil problem with some shorted turns or something. I pulled my B34 out after the winter and could not get it started. If you have identified the magneto as the source of your ignition fault send it to us for repair. LUCAS MAGNETO TROUBLESHOOTING | JRC Engineering, Inc. Any high tension magneto will have way more than 7 ohms resistance on the secondary circuit. [5] The hub of the magneto rotates while the drive shaft is held stationary, and the spring tension builds up. I'm thinking the magneto is weak even though it was rebuilt with new condenser.. I purchased this Lister D petrol (gasoline) engine that came on a trolley with an Aerograph air compressor. I highly doubt it is excessive unless someone has been grinding the rotor or the cap. Also, with the points open, check that there is an open circuit between them; if fitted with a Brightspark EasyCap, it will take a little while for the resistance reading to climb off the scale. Checked it over and found no spark. This allows the spring to unwind giving the rotating magnet a rapid rotation and letting the magneto spin at such a speed to produce a spark. If you do, then replace the pick-up. This will not stop the coil from working. I do not know it all but I will try to help. A JavaScript is disabled. "A Community of Antique Engine Enthusiasts." As the size of the combustion chamber determines the time to burn the fuel charge, dual ignition was especially important for the large-bore aircraft engines around World War II where it was necessary to combust the entire fuel mixture in a shorter time than a single plug could provide, in order to build peak cylinder pressure at the rpm desired. These faults do not necessarily occur instantaneously, they may develop over time leading to a gradual deterioration of the spark output. Put a smear of grease on the lobe(s) of the cam. However, if the outside of the pick-up is also oily, perhaps its all caused by an engine oil leak. Comment Guidelines: Do post respectful and insightful comments. the brush spring is not touching the terminal in the pick-up holder; the connection between the cable and the pick-up is corroded; the screw in the plug cap has gone down the side of the HT cable and not down its centre; Slip-ring [6], The first car to use magneto ignition was the 1901 German Mercedes 35 hp racing car, followed by various cars produced by Benz, Mors, Turcat-Mery, and Nesseldorf. 85 0 obj<>stream Lucas KF2 magneto failure - Britbike forum at some of the equipment we use in our workshop for magneto servicing Great post! pages on how to do that. The air gap between the rotor and the cap actually increases spark output as long as it's not excessive. If it is significantly higher, there is a bad connection or break in the low-tension circuit, in which case the magneto will need a more complete overhaul. Parts lists and workshop instructions, not magneto electronic ignition conversion, repairs Lucas & BTH, 5 year Translations provided by the Google Translate service. Having removed the contact-breaker assembly from the magneto, disassemble it, noting where each part was. Measure the resistance between the magneto body and terminal in one and then the other of the the plug caps. I have tried both Champion and NGK plugs. If the coil has been in service since the magneto was new there is a good chance the insulation has started to break down, allowing voltage to track. If necessary, dress the points on a fine stone. relating to our products, others more general Could be bad parts if spark just gets a lot weaker but if spark totally goes away when cap and rotor are installed, be sure the when you install them it does not short out the primary, give the rotor a closer ground to jump to or hold the points open, etc. If it is several thousand ohms, it indicates that the HT lead is resistive and/or the plug cap is fitted with a suppressor resistor. PDF LUCAS MAGNETOS - edknet.de From time to time we have complete [7] Ignition magnetos were soon was used on most cars, for both low voltage systems (which used secondary coils to fire the spark plugs) and high voltage magnetos (which fired the spark plug directly, similar to induction coil ignition). Brightspark Magnetos Ltd disclaims responsibility for any If you do not obtain readings substantially the same as the reading you obtained in the internal HT continuity section, and if everything else you previously checked is still good, it indicates that the pick-up brush(es) is/are not making good electrical contact with the brass of the slip ring. and just how were you able to find one of those bastards that still worked?!?!?! I do not think this is your issue because the timing light does not trigger. making your own bearing and slip-ring pullers; If there is a lubricating felt, soak it in oil. Nice work. With the engine running, place your hand over the pick-up with the same hand also touching the magneto body. With an open circuit the device has no CAPACITY to absorb the reaction voltage (back EMF) from the coil, therefore this energy is dissipated across the timing contact which quickly burns away. detailed support we offer. replace it with an EasyCap. books, learndpapers and patents on In the inductor magneto, the magnet is rotated and the coil remains stationary. Tri-Spark Ignitions; Pazon Ignitions; Lucas Rita; AGM Batteries For Classics; Lucas Alternators; Rectifiers & Voltage Control; Dynamo Parts; Magneto Parts; Lucas SR Magneto Spares; HT Coils For Classic Bikes; British Bike Points & Condensers; . If they look good I would replace the condenser if it has one and retest. A short circuit absorbs all the power, hence no output or spark. At least I assume so: My timing light (seen in photo clamped to plug wire #1) illuminates correctly when plug #1 is unscrewed from the engine and sparks, but it does not light up when the plug is screwed into the engine. specially-selected, top-quality, British-made If you havent already done so, undo the contact-breaker centre-screw and remove the contact-breaker assembly. Dansk instructions). Please note: THEY ARE NOT FOR SALE! Don't flame, hate, spam. Please phone or email for details. If you have a Megger or similar insulation tester, set it to test at 500V. A fair amount maintenance and troubleshooting of a magneto can be done with the magneto in situ and without any special tools or equipment other than a multimeter. Check that the advance/retard mechanism reliably rotates the cam back and forth. It uses a Bosch ZA4 magneto (rebuilt about 10 years back) which produces a nice blue spark in the plugs when they are out of the engine. Deutsch Rotate the armature and check that the contact-breaker assembly does not foul its housing. [7] Ignition magnetos were largely replaced by ignition coils once batteries became common in cars, since a battery-operated coil can provide a high-voltage spark even at low speeds, making starting easier.[8]. We recommend using non-resistive (copper) cable and unsuppressed plug caps. Check for any dirty marks on the paper. NEWS FLASH - March 2020 As you will understand, with the Covid-19 pandemic shutting down most normal business, we are not able to despatch orders for the time being. Wico-XH Magneto Won't Spark | Smokstak Antique Engine Community 0000000016 00000 n It uses a magneto and a transformer to make pulses of high voltage for the spark plugs.The older term "high-tension" means "high-voltage".Used on many cars in the early 20th century, ignition magnetos were largely replaced by induction coil . or
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